26-01-2021, 13:45
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#3076
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laeva recumbens anguis
Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Jun 2006
Age: 67
Services: Premiere Collection
Posts: 42,221
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Re: Coronavirus
Quote:
Originally Posted by downquark1
It's worth noting that the UK is ahead of most countries (I think 3rd in the world) for vaccine distribution. So props to the NHS and Boris.
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I’m with you in 50% of that...
Not sure what value BoJo added to the vaccine situation.
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26-01-2021, 13:52
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#3077
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cf.mega poster
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,288
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Re: Coronavirus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh
I’m with you in 50% of that...
Not sure what value BoJo added to the vaccine situation.
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He's appointed a good person to head up the programme
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55115037
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26-01-2021, 13:54
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#3078
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laeva recumbens anguis
Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Jun 2006
Age: 67
Services: Premiere Collection
Posts: 42,221
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Re: Coronavirus
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1andrew1
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OK - 75% then...
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26-01-2021, 14:09
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#3079
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cf.mega poster
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 14,288
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Re: Coronavirus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh
OK - 75% then...
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26-01-2021, 14:11
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#3080
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Sad Doig Fan!
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Barry South Wales
Age: 68
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Re: Coronavirus
Quote:
Originally Posted by downquark1
It's worth noting that the UK is ahead of most countries (I think 3rd in the world) for vaccine distribution. So props to the NHS and Boris.
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We are well ahead of the EU.
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26-01-2021, 14:11
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#3081
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Sulking in the Corner
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: RG41
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Posts: 11,955
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Re: Coronavirus
Am I right in thinking that the 12 week gap decision was foolhardy in the light of the (perfidious) EU position on vaccine exports? Might some first jab Pfizer recipients end up stranded?
The Guvmin's lack of transparency is worrying. Maybe there is a reason for this, like not giving the game away to the EU. But it would be better for Zahawi to say straight that we should accept his assurances because full disclosure would potentially prejudice supply arrangements or similar better than weasel words.
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Seph.
My advice is at your risk.
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26-01-2021, 14:28
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#3082
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vox populi vox dei
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: the last resort
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Posts: 13,739
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Re: Coronavirus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth
Am I right in thinking that the 12 week gap decision was foolhardy in the light of the (perfidious) EU position on vaccine exports? Might some first jab Pfizer recipients end up stranded?
The Guvmin's lack of transparency is worrying. Maybe there is a reason for this, like not giving the game away to the EU. But it would be better for Zahawi to say straight that we should accept his assurances because full disclosure would potentially prejudice supply arrangements or similar better than weasel words.
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We may or may not have enough vaccine to do the initial job the gov aren't giving much info away.
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To be or not to be, woke is the question Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer. The slings and arrows of outrageous wokedome, Or to take arms against a sea of wokies. And by opposing end them.
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26-01-2021, 14:58
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#3083
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Trollsplatter
Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Jun 2003
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Posts: 37,033
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Re: Coronavirus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth
Am I right in thinking that the 12 week gap decision was foolhardy in the light of the (perfidious) EU position on vaccine exports? Might some first jab Pfizer recipients end up stranded?
The Guvmin's lack of transparency is worrying. Maybe there is a reason for this, like not giving the game away to the EU. But it would be better for Zahawi to say straight that we should accept his assurances because full disclosure would potentially prejudice supply arrangements or similar better than weasel words.
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Unlikely, because so far the Oxford-AstraZenica vaccine is the only truly versatile vaccine available, the EU is going to need a substantial amount of it eventually, and it is mostly made in the UK. If the EU were to put export controls on consignments we had already contracted and paid for, all they would achieve would be to find their supplies of Ox/AZ compromised by HMG defensively doing likewise. Ultimately, nobody wins.
I also think you need to stop fretting over lack of transparency. Vaccine production, distribution and storage is highly sensitive information. Excessive details of the timetable present a risk to public order in the event that unforeseen problems cause delays.
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26-01-2021, 16:51
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#3084
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The Dark Satanic Mills
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: floating in the ether
Posts: 12,072
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Re: Coronavirus
As we pass 100,000 deaths.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55757378
The distribution is interesting.
99% of deaths aged 45 or over
90% of deaths aged 65 or over
75% of deaths aged 75 or over
42% of deaths aged 85 or over
30% of all deaths within Care Homes.
All the data based on the rather loose definition of dying within 28days of a positive test, regardless of any other conditions the individual may have had.
__________________
The wheel's still turning but the hamsters dead.
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26-01-2021, 17:08
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#3085
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10 yrs same company 😁
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Expanding Town with crap roads
Age: 64
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Posts: 7,665
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Re: Coronavirus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre
As we pass 100,000 deaths.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55757378
The distribution is interesting.
99% of deaths aged 45 or over
90% of deaths aged 65 or over
75% of deaths aged 75 or over
42% of deaths aged 85 or over
30% of all deaths within Care Homes.
All the data based on the rather loose definition of dying within 28days of a positive test, regardless of any other conditions the individual may have had.
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ONS Figures are more accurate and include those who have died with CV-19 as a factor, regardless of how long it took them to die from 1st test/diagnosis.
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26-01-2021, 17:14
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#3086
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cf.mega poster
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: #Plagueisland
Age: 53
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Posts: 1,675
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Re: Coronavirus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth
@jonbxx
Jon - you might know the answer.
Let's say that a CV sufferer of a couple of months tests positive at that point. That sufferer appears to be recovering.
Some people are saying that although testing positive, the sufferer is no longer contagious. Is that right? Can the swab test differentiate between active and inactive virus cells? Logic tells me that whatever the sufferer is spewing out at that point would be contagion unless virus cells detected were inactive.
Cheers.
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I can answer that, no problems. The current COVID RT-PCR test looks for SARS-Cov2 RNA only. When you have a swab taken, the swab is put in to a solution full of nice ingredients which break down the virus including the proteins around it. This opens things up for testing and stabilises the RNA.
We are full of enzymes which happily break down RNA and this is a good thing. RNA is how we make proteins so you make RNA to make proteins and the enzymes which break down RNA are an 'off switch', stopping the protein manufacture. RNA in cells doesn't hand around long with a half life usually of minutes to hours. Again, this is a good thing. The mRNA vaccines have had their mRNA modified to slow down the rate they are broken down in the cell
Now, the virus could be inactive in that it can't get into cells but still be picked up by the COVID test. The big question is how long would virus hang around in the usual places for a test swab. The inside of the nose and back of throat are designed to trap and kill nasties so the environment is pretty harsh but it's certainly not impossible for some virus to hang around.
A big deal is made of the 'number of cycles' for a COVID test. The test makes copies of DNA from the SARS-Cov2 RNA, DNA being easier to handle. It's the DNA we are measuring during a test. Each cycle of making more DNA amplifies the amount present until you can measure it. However, the more cycles you have, the more chance of picking something up that isn't really there by mistake which could give you a higher false positive rate.
So yes, the current COVID test could pick up false signals from RNA from dead virus and if you push things too hard, you can get false positives from nothing. The unknown thing here is how long SARS-COV2 RNA will hang about in a throat or nose. the general feeling is not long.
You could try and culture virus from suspected COVID patients but this is hard and time consuming. It could a couple of weeks to get a result so at present, the RT-PCR test is the best we have
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26-01-2021, 17:20
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#3087
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The Dark Satanic Mills
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: floating in the ether
Posts: 12,072
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Re: Coronavirus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Angua
ONS Figures are more accurate and include those who have died with CV-19 as a factor, regardless of how long it took them to die from 1st test/diagnosis.
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That’s just as spurious.
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The wheel's still turning but the hamsters dead.
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26-01-2021, 17:38
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#3088
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laeva recumbens anguis
Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Jun 2006
Age: 67
Services: Premiere Collection
Posts: 42,221
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Re: Coronavirus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre
As we pass 100,000 deaths.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55757378
The distribution is interesting.
99% of deaths aged 45 or over
90% of deaths aged 65 or over
75% of deaths aged 75 or over
42% of deaths aged 85 or over
30% of all deaths within Care Homes.
All the data based on the rather loose definition of dying within 28days of a positive test, regardless of any other conditions the individual may have had.
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Those age groups make up 1/3 of the U.K. population.
What are all these extra people dying of (80k+ YTD over the 5 year average, and the number of deaths registered in the UK in the week ending 15 January 2021 was 20,019, which was 4,347 higher than the five-year average), if COVID is not contributing to the deaths?
__________________
There is always light.
If only we’re brave enough to see it.
If only we’re brave enough to be it.
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Last edited by Hugh; 26-01-2021 at 17:46.
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26-01-2021, 17:38
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#3089
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Rise above the players
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Wokingham
Services: 2 V6 boxes with 360 software, Now, ITVX, Amazon, Netflix, Lionsgate+, Apple+, Disney+, Paramount +,
Posts: 14,618
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Re: Coronavirus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh
I’m with you in 50% of that...
Not sure what value BoJo added to the vaccine situation.
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So in your world, when something goes wrong it’s Boris’s fault and when it goes right it’s to someone else’s credit.
No bias there in your thinking, then....
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Forumbox.co.uk
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26-01-2021, 17:41
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#3090
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laeva recumbens anguis
Cable Forum Team
Join Date: Jun 2006
Age: 67
Services: Premiere Collection
Posts: 42,221
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Re: Coronavirus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pierre
That’s just as spurious.
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In what way?
---------- Post added at 17:41 ---------- Previous post was at 17:39 ----------
Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY
So in your world, when something goes wrong it’s Boris’s fault and when it goes right it’s to someone else’s credit.
No bias there in your thinking, then....
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No - I’ve defended him on this in the past, when he was blamed for things beyond his control.
Your thinking that shows the bias in your thinking - seems to be "my Boris, tight or wrong!".
He’s in charge - he doesn’t like doing things that are unpopular, which has meant delays in lockdowns or other measures being implemented.
__________________
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If only we’re brave enough to be it.
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