Britain outside the EU

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Good deal for EU know who!

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/othe...29031ab0c8d951

Which proves what? You are getting desperate now, Andrew!

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

The result was due to lies, the fact we're here talking about it proves it, where are the sunlit uplands, where is the German car industry not standing for it, what's happened to the fishermen and farmers who were promised the earth and now don't have jobs or businesses, I'm no remaniac as I don't want us going back in after all this but at the same time I want the people responsible to be held account, Where's the 40 million Turks that were on their way here, they get lost or something and the government was given such a democratic mandate to get this sorted, Where's the oven ready deal, instead all we're getting is it's the EUs fault because we never expected then to sign the deal, wtf what sort of reckless incompetent cretin would take a chance like that, we're only going to break international law in a limited way, wtf it's still breaking it cretin, that victorian hat stand has spent months looking for a brexit dividend and got so desperate he resorted to asking The Sun readers for their's but he made sure he got his dividend by opening up an office in the EU.

You might have been prepared for economic pain but how many of the 52% were, they were promised no pain, they were only promised better and this is not better

It proves nothing of the sort. Brexit isn’t a result on lies, remember there was LIES on both sides of the fence, both weighted to gain extra votes, so each other’s lies cancelling each other’s out. If here had been just the one Democratic exercise, the Brexit vote itself, you could have a valid point. However, several Democratic exercises later, the last, 3 years ago, giving the party that said it would get Brexit done, largest majority in a long time. None of the Anti-Brexit MPs who left Tory/Labour party prior to GE in 2019, kept their seats. Liberal Democrats who said they’d reverse Brexit, lost their leader, if the country really really wanted to stop Brexit, why didn’t every Liberal Democrat candidate, in most seats win?

We need to stop repeating the “lies” tropes. Brexit vote was legitimate.

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by Mick

It proves nothing of the sort. Brexit isn’t a result on lies, remember there was LIES on both sides of the fence, both weighted to gain extra votes, so each other’s lies cancelling each other’s out. If here had been just the one Democratic exercise, the Brexit vote itself, you could have a valid point. However, several Democratic exercises later, the last, 3 years ago, giving the party that said it would get Brexit done, largest majority in a long time. None of the Anti-Brexit MPs who left Tory/Labour party prior to GE in 2019, kept their seats. Liberal Democrats who said they’d reverse Brexit, lost their leader, if the country really really wanted to stop Brexit, why didn’t every Liberal Democrat candidate, in most seats win?

We need to stop repeating the “lies” tropes. Brexit vote was legitimate.

Been having a look at my posting history and I've been pretty consistent throughout about holding people accountable for what they've said and why I think it's so important to do so

I think this referendum campaign is possibly the worst display I've ever seen from our politicians, even worse than new labour new danger, it was the worse kind of lies, fear mongering and pure ignorance I've ever seen displayed. How anyone could be pleased or proud to have been part of either campaign is beyond me and sadly this could well be the politics of the future, I'd rather go back to punch and Judy.

That's the question right there for me, do we want future elections fought like that one?


Plus there is this one from mid 2012 which surprised me so much I thought I'd share, didn't think I was still a kipper back then tbh and iirc it's after call me dave gave his guarantee for the referendum

They'll be getting my vote again, if they could find a few issues that turn them from a single issue campaign group and into a proper party in voters eyes they'll do very well.

[ianch99]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Which proves what? You are getting desperate now, Andrew!

https://twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/sta...06914266398725

2/ Under the Withdrawal Agreement the UK was handed a departure bill of €49.2 billion, which was reduced to €47.5 billion because of London’s share of fines paid into the EU’s coffers worth €1.8 billion as well as other adjustments.

Here's Vote Leave saying a divorce bill of this magnitude is "project fear".

https://twitter.com/i/status/999258109506916352

What don't you get here?

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by ianch99

<SNIP>



Here's Vote Leave saying a divorce bill of this magnitude is "project fear".

https://twitter.com/i/status/999258109506916352

What don't you get here?

Are you suggesting that it would have been better to remain in the EU because of the true size of the divorce bill?

All I see here from you is sour grapes. We are well rid of being subject to Brussels' rules.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by ianch99

https://twitter.com/tconnellyRTE/sta...06914266398725



Here's Vote Leave saying a divorce bill of this magnitude is "project fear".

https://twitter.com/i/status/999258109506916352

What don't you get here?

But that was money we owed. Have you forgotten that £100m+ that remainers said we would end up paying?

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

But that was money we owed. Have you forgotten that £100m+ that remainers said we would end up paying?

Old Boy, it would be lovely if you could follow ianch99 by supplying links to back-up your assertions.

---------- Post added at 19:34 ---------- Previous post was at 19:23 ----------

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

We are well rid of being subject to Brussels' rules.

Which rules from Brussels should we stop following? How much will ending such rules compensate for the 4%+ in GDP we've lost from not being part of the EU?

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

<SNIP>
Which rules from Brussels should we stop following? How much will ending such rules compensate for the 4%+ in GDP we've lost from not being part of the EU?

As I've consistently said, freedom from rules made in Brussels, usually to suit the French, with wheezes like the WTD being perpetrated to combat the UK veto - that's what's important. The GDP dip will be recovered - that's what business does.

So it's not about "which rules we should stop following". It's about sovereignty and the freedom to choose the rules to which we will be bound.

BREAKING: Labour Party vow to not bring UK back in to EU or Single Market, if they win back power in 2024.

https://news.sky.com/story/make-brex...blems-12645809

That will put the cat amongst the Remainiac pigeons.

[1andrew1]

This looks like Project Fear on steroids! Fortunately for my heart it's paywalled.

We are on track for a currency crisis – and bankruptcy

Our leaders fail to grasp that taking back control also means taking back responsibility

Britain's current account deficit is easily the biggest such deficit ever.

Jeepers! We may be all tightening our belts in response to the cost of living squeeze, but as a nation, we are still spending far more than we are earning.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business...is-bankruptcy/

---------- Post added at 20:03 ---------- Previous post was at 19:58 ----------

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

As I've consistently said, freedom from rules made in Brussels, usually to suit the French, with wheezes like the WTD being perpetrated to combat the UK veto - that's what's important. The GDP dip will be recovered - that's what business does.

So it's not about "which rules we should stop following". It's about sovereignty and the freedom to choose the rules to which we will be bound.

Not sure employing lots of bureaucrats to certify your EU exports, therefore making them less competitive, ticks the box on reducing the GDP decline. I prescribe more Jeremy Warner.

Originally Posted by Mick

BREAKING: Labour Party vow to not bring UK back in to EU or Single Market, if they win back power in 2024.

https://news.sky.com/story/make-brex...blems-12645809

That will put the cat amongst the Remainiac pigeons.

Labour doesn't want to lose the next election it seems.

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by Mick

BREAKING: Labour Party vow to not bring UK back in to EU or Single Market, if they win back power in 2024.

https://news.sky.com/story/make-brex...blems-12645809

That will put the cat amongst the Remainiac pigeons.

Is that the policy of the whole Labour party, or just one person who on a temporary basis is supposedly in charge of the party?
Meaningless gesture.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by Damien

Labour doesn't want to lose the next election it seems.

The time is not ripe to campaign for a referendum to join the EU Single Market. This is sensible step.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Damien

Labour doesn't want to lose the next election it seems.

I would rephrase that as, Labour want to win the next election.

The former implies something else.

[ianch99]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

Are you suggesting that it would have been better to remain in the EU because of the true size of the divorce bill?

All I see here from you is sour grapes. We are well rid of being subject to Brussels' rules.

Pure deflection. I am pointing out one of the pure unadulterated lies made during the campaign. Let's focus on what was promised and what is reality.

You aim to conjure up a childish name calling game when, in all seriousness, this is the fate of the country we are talking about. You can call names in the playground or debate how we mitigate the devastating effects of this catastrophic decision.

---------- Post added at 23:05 ---------- Previous post was at 23:04 ----------

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

But that was money we owed. Have you forgotten that £100m+ that remainers said we would end up paying?

Again pure deflection. We have reality and we have OB's version ...

---------- Post added at 23:06 ---------- Previous post was at 23:05 ----------

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

As I've consistently said, freedom from rules made in Brussels, usually to suit the French, with wheezes like the WTD being perpetrated to combat the UK veto - that's what's important. The GDP dip will be recovered - that's what business does.

So it's not about "which rules we should stop following". It's about sovereignty and the freedom to choose the rules to which we will be bound.

Said like a true follower. You know those who frequently "say it was all sovereignty and I'd pay any price" are those who can well afford to do so.