The energy crisis

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...e-nationalised

Still waiting for the list of massive profits that the UK domestic energy SUPPLIERS are making.
New supplies of gas? There's a worldwide shortage. That is the reason for high prices. Although I do wonder that if there are shortages, who is going without?

How exactly do city bonuses fuel inflation? They are taxed anyway. At least they are generating the income to pay those bonuses.

Germany is looking at a 20% reduction in gas usage, AND a 20% reduction in gas going through their pipelines to other countries, and even then, they are having to look at the priority of which industries might have to shut down.

[jfman]

Originally Posted by nomadking

Still waiting for the list of massive profits that the UK domestic energy SUPPLIERS are making

You’ve been told this is a pointless, arbitrary distinction (as opposed to considering the market as a whole) that has no value to the discussion.

---------- Post added at 08:25 ---------- Previous post was at 08:24 ----------

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...e-nationalised

Socialism for fat cats. Nationalise the losses, privatise the profits. The banking crisis all over again.

How about we privatise the losses and nationalise the profits?

Originally Posted by nomadking

Still waiting for the list of massive profits that the UK domestic energy SUPPLIERS are making.
New supplies of gas? There's a worldwide shortage. That is the reason for high prices. Although I do wonder that if there are shortages, who is going without?

How exactly do city bonuses fuel inflation? They are taxed anyway. At least they are generating the income to pay those bonuses.

Germany is looking at a 20% reduction in gas usage, AND a 20% reduction in gas going through their pipelines to other countries, and even then, they are having to look at the priority of which industries might have to shut down.

Yeh, unlike those useless teachers, doctors, nurses, train staff - all they do is educate future generations, save lives, get people to work; where’s the income generation in that?

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by Hugh

Yeh, unlike those useless teachers, doctors, nurses, train staff - all they do is educate future generations, save lives, get people to work; where’s the income generation in that?

The claim is that the bonuses fuel inflation, they don't, so somebody is telling fibs. The bonuses are already funded, all the other large pay demands are not.
It is large pay rises for larger groups, that would fuel large pay demands from others, and therefore fuel inflation. Where is all the money expected to come from? Higher taxes?
What was the "solution" for double digit inflation under a previous Labour government? Below inflation pay rises(agreed with the Unions) and what would now be called austerity.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by nomadking

Still waiting for the list of massive profits that the UK domestic energy SUPPLIERS are making.
New supplies of gas? There's a worldwide shortage. That is the reason for high prices. Although I do wonder that if there are shortages, who is going without?

How exactly do city bonuses fuel inflation? They are taxed anyway. At least they are generating the income to pay those bonuses.

Germany is looking at a 20% reduction in gas usage, AND a 20% reduction in gas going through their pipelines to other countries, and even then, they are having to look at the priority of which industries might have to shut down.

I think you have quoted the wrong post, did you mean to quote jfman's?

---------- Post added at 10:35 ---------- Previous post was at 10:13 ----------

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

I wonder how small businesses will cope, they don't have a cap and whilst everyone naturally thinks of industry I heard a corner shop owner from Glasgow saying his electric bill was now 56k per year, how can businesses like that reasonably be expected to pass that on to customers

I think we'll see many shops and hospitality outlets having to reduce their hours and some handing back the keys. And still the Conservative Party leader challengers are against onshore wind turbines.

Landlady gives up pub as quarterly energy bills near £30,000

A village pub landlady has decided to give up her business after her energy bills hit nearly £30,000 a quarter.

Miranda Richardson said she would leave the Live and Let Live pub in Harpole, Northampton, after her gas bill hit more than £7,700, and her electricity bill was "just shy of £20,000".

She is one of many grappling with the rising costs of running businesses at a time when people are watching budgets.

Unlike households, firms are not protected by an energy price cap.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-61743920

Interesting read on what other countries are doing.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/61522123

[Taf]

During the build-up to this massive price increase, and all the way up to now, the one thing I still haven't heard mentioned is O.P.E.C.

It's all being blamed on individual companies and governments.

Another interesting read - this site has been collecting data on energy prices in Europe since 2009.

https://www.energypriceindex.com/

In it's latest press release, it has a graph of consumer electricity prices throughout Europe.

https://publuu.com/flip-book/6678/108615/page/1

Originally Posted by Taf

During the build-up to this massive price increase, and all the way up to now, the one thing I still haven't heard mentioned is O.P.E.C.

It's all being blamed on individual companies and governments.

The clue might be in the name - Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries

They are Oil/Petroleum, not Gas...

[ianch99]

I think that there is one point that demonstrates that the whole privatised energy sector is a scam and that is whilst the UK produces nearly 50% of renewable electricity, where the production costs are not impacted by oil/gas prices, the price of electricity presented to the consumer is rising in line with gas.

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by ianch99

I think that there is one point that demonstrates that the whole privatised energy sector is a scam and that is whilst the UK produces nearly 50% of renewable electricity, where the production costs are not impacted by oil/gas prices, the price of electricity presented to the consumer is rising in line with gas.

Link

What happened in July?
Gas again topped the generation mix at 43.7%, with zero carbon sources providing 43% overall, peaking at 80% at their highest across the month.

---------- Post added at 12:50 ---------- Previous post was at 12:48 ----------

Originally Posted by Hugh

The clue might be in the name - Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries

They are Oil/Petroleum, not Gas...

They also produce Gas, which can nowadays be shipped around the world in LNG tankers.

---------- Post added at 13:00 ---------- Previous post was at 12:50 ----------

Originally Posted by jfman

You’ve been told this is a pointless, arbitrary distinction (as opposed to considering the market as a whole) that has no value to the discussion.

---------- Post added at 08:25 ---------- Previous post was at 08:24 ----------



Socialism for fat cats. Nationalise the losses, privatise the profits. The banking crisis all over again.

How about we privatise the losses and nationalise the profits?

Energy companies that cannot offer lower bills should be temporarily brought into public ownership, Gordon Brown has said,

How can they offer "lower bills" using non-existent profits? How many energy suppliers have UK based parent companies in the first place?

If you were to do a survey asking which supplier people had, and asked if that supplier making "massive profits", what do you think they would say?
So who apart from me, and perhaps a few others, ISN'T saying that the suppliers are making "massive profits"?

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by nomadking

How can they offer "lower bills" using non-existent profits?

Gordon Brown has suggested nationalising them if they can't.

[nomadking]

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

Gordon Brown has suggested nationalising them if they can't.

So how many could? He is still promoting the LIE, that the SUPPLIERS are making "massive profits".

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by nomadking

So how many could? He is still promoting the LIE, that the SUPPLIERS are making "massive profits".

He's coming up with a solution to the problem which you're not. If they cannot afford it, he's offering to nationalise them. That would settle your argument conclusively.

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

If they cannot afford it, he's offering to nationalise them.

The Labour answer to everything.

So how precisely would it help ? and how would it be paid for ?