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At the informal Commonwealth of Independent States summit in St. Petersburg, Russian President Vladimir Putin presented the CIS leaders with club rings that look like they are made of yellow and white gold. Each ring’s design incorporates the CIS emblem and the words “Happy New Year 2023.”
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Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
Gift-giving can create a sense of powerful largesse around the giver and obligation on the part of the receiver and being seen wearing the gift could magnify that. It’s perhaps notable that only his known lap dog, Lukashenko of Belarus, immediately put his ring on.
In a funny sort of way this actually is a power play of sorts. There’s no doubt Putin really needs these people onside now. Though in their minds there should be no doubt that in the long run their prospects for remaining in independent control of their territories is slim, if Russia gets away with its adventurism in Ukraine (though I very much doubt it will).
There is a definite view from some who do not support Ukraine's ability to fight against invasion, and that is that this is a "proxy war" between the West and Russia. I am unclear what this means in the real world so if anyone does think this, please share your analysis.
“There’s nothing that provokes vladimir putin more than weakness,” John McCain in 2014 about not giving Ukraine weapons & next steps of Kremlin dictator
He is saying that in 2014, the US not only denied Ukraine weapons when Putin invaded eastern Ukraine, they denied intelligence as well. This appeasement was the "provocation" that Putin needed to resume his invasion in 2022.
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Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
Quote:
Originally Posted by ianch99
There is a definite view from some who do not support Ukraine's ability to fight against invasion, and that is that this is a "proxy war" between the West and Russia. I am unclear what this means in the real world so if anyone does think this, please share your analysis.
He is saying that in 2014, the US not only denied Ukraine weapons when Putin invaded eastern Ukraine, they denied intelligence as well. This appeasement was the "provocation" that Putin needed to resume his invasion in 2022.
Ruth Deyermond, senior lecturer in War Studies at KCL, posted an interesting and relevant Twitter thread this morning. Under the general heading of ‘advice for the year ahead’ she lists several observations re Ukraine and Russia. Points 5 and 6 are particularly relevant to some of the stuff that has been posted on this forum in recent days and weeks:
Quote:
5. Stop both-sidesing. You cannot draw any equivalence between Russia conducting a genocidal war of conquest, carried out by rapists and child-torturers, and Ukraine fighting for its survival.
Quote:
6. Stop amplifying Russian lines designed to weaken Western support for Ukraine. Yes, nuclear threats make exciting headlines, and claims about US proxy wars might appeal to your readership, but it distorts perceptions and helps the aggressor.
I am getting less tolerant of those that remain sympathetic to Russia since the start of the invasion. There has always been a useful idiot symptom of people who see Russia as a foil to an 'imperialistic' West and NATO, especially on the left, but the way people now contort themselves to continue to find a reason to equivocate on Russia invading Ukraine makes me think it's not naive at all. They know who Putin is and they like it.
What's new is these tankies on the left have been joined by right-wing anti-establishment conspiracy theorists who idolise dictators like Putin.
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Re: Russia has invaded Ukraine
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul
Perhaps people are just fed up of paying for a war that isnt ours, rather than being "sympathetic" to Russia.
This is extremely short-sighted.
Russia almost immediately responded to European opposition to its genocide in Ukraine by choking off gas supplies. How can you say its not our war when a genocidal dictatorship is overtly attempting to influence our politics in this way?
Should we just accept that Russia has the whip hand over our foreign policy due to our energy dependency and just let it do whatever it wants?
Perhaps people are just fed up of paying for a war that isnt ours, rather than being "sympathetic" to Russia.
Depends on what you mean by "ours". This is a war of aggression on mainland Europe which if was allowed to play out by those wishing to appease Putin would have untold consequences. Putin has a vision of a Greater Russia along the lines of a weird pseudo-USSR, a nostalgic vision of a Russia that can take what it wants through strength of arms and financial muscle.
The money we are spending to help Ukraine is small: 2.3 billion out of a GDP around 2.7 trillion. However it is money well spent, like an insurance policy against a much larger & expensive problem if Putin is allowed to run riot.
History tells us that appeasement is the wrong policy ...
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Russia almost immediately responded to European opposition to its genocide in Ukraine by choking off gas supplies. How can you say its not our war when a genocidal dictatorship is overtly attempting to influence our politics in this way?
Should we just accept that Russia has the whip hand over our foreign policy due to our energy dependency and just let it do whatever it wants?
Yeah we preferred it when they covertly influenced our politics buying politicians and interfering with elections or when they poisoned our citizens or assassinated opponents on our streets, I'm glad we are sending Ukraine cash, they're fighting a war so we don't eventually have to imo
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