Britain outside the EU

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by jfman

Hang on, OB. Is that real GDP or nominal GDP? And what does growth look like when you adjust for inflation?

Your point being….?

[jfman]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Your point being….?

If you have to ask, against the backdrop of the highest inflation in Western Europe, you probably shouldn’t be gloating that our economic growth is a rounding error better than Germany’s.

The support of Trussonomics and crazy Kwasi’s budget all makes sense now.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

We win some, we lose some. There’s nothing new in that.

If we're not appearing on short lists for new manufacturers due to Brexit, then how can we win their plants?

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Of course you would say that. Your mind is closed to arguments that go against your mindset and prove you wrong.

Instead of slagging off the sources of information provided to you to back up statements people make, why not actually look at what the articles say? Then if you disagree, let’s hear why.

If you are telling me that the facts here are wrong, let’s see some back up for your assertion.

My real point is that any twerp can find negative stories to back up their claims. But true thinkers look at both sides of the argument and come up with a reasoned opinion.

All we hear from remainers are the negative stories. All the positive ones are ignored. That is what makes contributing to this debate on here so tiresome.

Always look at the source, rather than interpretations of the source…



https://www.oecd.org/economic-outlook/march-2023/

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by Hugh

Always look at the source, rather than interpretations of the source…



https://www.oecd.org/economic-outlook/march-2023/

You do realise that they are projections, don’t you, Hugh? Out of date, to boot, and proved wrong already. We are not now projected to go into recession, whereas Germany is.

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Germany's economy is doing worse than ours...

On most measures, this statement is blatantly wrong. Germany is more prosperous and has a lower inflation rate than the UK, for example. However, you are right to point out that Germany has likely tipped into recession which the UK may avoid.

Useful links
https://www.worlddata.info/country-c...U&country2=GBR
https://countryeconomy.com/countries/compare/germany/uk

[jfman]

Like a bald English man fighting over a comb.

Inflation is high, living standards are falling. Ah, but our economic growth (not adjusted for inflation) is a fraction of one per cent higher than Germany

Pray, tell, OB how many centuries would that have to persist for before living standards rise in this country?

[ianch99]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

Come off it, Ian, both sides lied.

And it has not been a catastrophe. True, the review of EU laws and so on has taken longer to get under way, but Covid lost us some valuable time. It's picking up now, with the first EU laws being extinguished and replaced within months and the remainder to follow. The Pacific trade deal is agreed and will provide a real fillip to our economy, particularly as it will cover favourable conditions for the service sector, our biggest earner.

Germany's economy is doing worse than ours, and yet you don't take into account these facts, preferring to concentrate on negative comparisons. It's a bit of an obsession, isn't it?

OB, I am not going to debate objective reality. Been there, done that. If you cannot be honest enough to accept that what the electorate was promised were lies then there is no debate possible.

As for Germany, for a G7 economy that is in the midst of re-engineering its industrial dependency on Russian gas it doing a pretty good job considering. The UK has no such dependency.

[TheDaddy]

Originally Posted by jfman

Like a bald English man fighting over a comb.

Inflation is high, living standards are falling. Ah, but our economic growth (not adjusted for inflation) is a fraction of one per cent higher than Germany

Pray, tell, OB how many centuries would that have to persist for before living standards rise in this country?

Imagine trumpeting the economy merely stagnating as some sort of victory, I know the bar is low but really, that's a win now days

[1andrew1]

Originally Posted by TheDaddy

Imagine trumpeting the economy merely stagnating as some sort of victory, I know the bar is low but really, that's a win now days

Apparently, the celebrations in Wokingham over the economy eclipsed those celebrations in Goodison Park on Sunday, although there was a neat symmetry to both.

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

You do realise that they are projections, don’t you, Hugh? Out of date, to boot, and proved wrong already. We are not now projected to go into recession, whereas Germany is.

How about recent history, then?

https://www.oecd.org/newsroom/gdp-gr...-2023-oecd.htm

btw, all those countries went through "COVID, Putin, etc…".

[OLD BOY]

I guess it all depends on the period you choose to compare.

[jfman]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

I guess it all depends on the period you choose to compare.

I know; it’s as if you and your sources cherrypicked data to suit a fledgeling argument. And ignore inflation, of course.

Are British people getting better off relative to Germans? An irrelevance for those like yourself that consider the country a roulette wheel from which to offshore our wealth and take it elsewhere.

[OLD BOY]

Originally Posted by ianch99

OB, I am not going to debate objective reality. Been there, done that. If you cannot be honest enough to accept that what the electorate was promised were lies then there is no debate possible.

As for Germany, for a G7 economy that is in the midst of re-engineering its industrial dependency on Russian gas it doing a pretty good job considering. The UK has no such dependency.

And you should be honest enough to acknowledge that I said both sides lied. How could you have missed that?

---------- Post added at 13:41 ---------- Previous post was at 13:32 ----------

Originally Posted by jfman

I know; it’s as if you and your sources cherrypicked data to suit a fledgeling argument. And ignore inflation, of course.

Are British people getting better off relative to Germans? An irrelevance for those like yourself that consider the country a roulette wheel from which to offshore our wealth and take it elsewhere.

I’m cherry picking?

It’s not me deliberately ignoring the positive stories all the time and just picking out the negative ones.

I didn’t hear anyone on here cheering when it was announced that UK growth in 2022 was 4.1%, but there you go.

It’s all doom and gloom on this forum. I guess it always has been.

[jfman]

That’s because against the backdrop of the highest inflation in Western Europe the growth is imaginary. It exists on a spreadsheet. In the real world it’s the biggest drop in living standards since World War 2.