Rugby World Cup 2011

[denphone]

Yes bad luck to Wales who deserved better.

---------- Post added at 11:00 ---------- Previous post was at 10:56 ----------

Full time score

Wales 8 France 9


http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/ma...oot+into+wales

[Russ]

Paddy Power have decided to refund all losing Welsh bets due to the poor decision of the ref.

[alwaysabear]

Originally Posted by denphone

Yes bad luck to Wales who deserved better.

---------- Post added at 11:00 ---------- Previous post was at 10:56 ----------

Full time score

Wales 8 France 9


http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/home/ma...oot+into+wales

The ref has robbed us of a great final the Welsh would have put up a far better showing than the French ever would.

[Osem]

Another one of 'those' decisions but over the years many teams have been badly hurt as a result of similarly dubious decisons in big matches like this. There's no doubt in my mind that it was a yellow card offence but as for the red, well I've heard the IRB's rules effectively took the decision out of the ref's hands. As I stated earlier in this thread, I reckon there must be room for some form of intervention in cases likes this. If the TMO can ruminate for an eternity over the grounding of a ball I don't see why there shouldn't be some form of review system when a big decision is clearly contentious.

All that having been said, the final penalty chance for Wales should have been a French penalty and I don't suppose the Welsh fans would've complained too much about winning in that manner had the kick gone over. Winning is what matters and you can say what you like about the French but they're in the final and the home nations aren't. Furthermore, they haven't got there playing pretty rugby or even winning all their matches but the history books won't care about any of that. The Welsh will rue their missed kicks and the dithering right at the death which led to them wasting a good drop goal chance.

Tomorrow's game ought to be a cracker and I hope it lives up to its billing.

[denphone]

Wales captain Sam Warburton will miss Wales' World Cup third-place play-off match after receiving a three-week ban for his "dangerous tip tackle" in the semi-final defeat by France and again we have another over the top punishment for something that was generally given a yellow card in our hemisphere.



http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugb...h/15325714.stm

[gazzae]

Originally Posted by denphone

Wales captain Sam Warburton will miss Wales' World Cup third-place play-off match after receiving a three-week ban for his "dangerous tip tackle" in the semi-final defeat by France and again we have another over the top punishment for something that was generally given a yellow card in our hemisphere.



http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugb...h/15325714.stm

You realise the ref was from our hemisphere?
Anyway from looking back it appears the ref was correct and didn't have a choice.
A 2009 IRB memo states

In 2007, the IRB Council approved a Laws Designated Members Ruling which essentially made it clear that tackles involving a player being lifted off the ground and tipped horizontally and were then either forced or dropped to the ground are illegal and constitute dangerous play.

The lifted player is dropped to the ground from a height with no regard to the player’s safety. A red card should be issued for this type of tackle.

http://www.rugbyrefs.com/wiki/index....gerous_Tackles

[denphone]

Originally Posted by gazzae

You realise the ref was from our hemisphere?
Anyway from looking back it appears the ref was correct and didn't have a choice.
A 2009 IRB memo states

Yes l know this but granted that this was a important World cup semi final l feel a bit more commom sense amd leniency was needed on this occasion but again we have over zealous officials who patently fail to take into account that this was a world cup semi final so in my mind a yellow card would have sufficed.

[gazzae]

Originally Posted by denphone

Yes l know this but granted that this was a important World cup semi final l feel a bit more commom sense amd leniency was needed on this occasion but again we have over zealous officials who patently fail to take into account that this was a world cup semi final so in my mind a yellow card would have sufficed.

What other laws should be ignored because its a semi-final?

[denphone]

Originally Posted by gazzae

What other laws should be ignored because its a semi-final?

l am not calling for laws to be ignored but we also have to have a bit of leniency and common sense in such a important match but instead we have over zealous officials who do everything 100% to the law and in by doing that they tend to ruin important occasions but please explain to me what you would do.

[gazzae]

Originally Posted by denphone

l am not calling for laws to be ignored but we also have to have a bit of leniency and common sense in such a important match but instead we have over zealous officials who do everything 100% to the law and in by doing that they tend to ruin important occasions but please explain to me what you would do.

You clearly are calling for laws to be ignored if you don't want the ref to "do everything 100% to the law"

[denphone]

Originally Posted by gazzae

You clearly are calling for laws to be ignored if you don't want the ref to "do everything 100% to the law"

Now l did now say that but what l am saying there should be a certain degree of common sense and leniency when applying the laws of the game and he did not do that.

[Osem]

It's not as simple as all that is it. Imagine how the losing side in a RWC final would feel having lost out because the ref decided to ignore a major rule and use his judgement instead. Suddenly 'common sense' becomes bad refereeing at best and favouritism at worst. Had Warburton not been sent off and France gone out I dare say the French would have had quite a bit to say about that decision and I don't think they'd have been praising the ref for using his common sense.

The IRB defined the rule quite clearly so from what I can see the ref. had no choice in the matter. If the rules regarding these situations are rewritten to allow more 'interpretation' by the ref. and require consultation with the other match officials before decisions are made in such cases then that might be the best, if not perfect, way to deal with scenarios like this.

Having said that, had the rules been equally clear when the Lions played the All Blacks in 2005, Brian O'Driscoll almost certainly wouldn't have been dangerously spear tackled and forced out of the tour. If he had been, at least the 2 players involved would've been sent off and missed the rest of the series - a fitting punishment. That wouldn't have been a bad result for those of us who want to see an end to seriously dangerous and cynical play.

[gazzae]

Originally Posted by denphone

Now l did now say that but what l am saying there should be a certain degree of common sense and leniency when applying the laws of the game and he did not do that.

You did say that.
The refs have been given a direct order, if a player is tipped and dropped then you must send the tackler off. I fail to see how you can argue for them to ignore this.

[denphone]

Originally Posted by Osem

It's not as simple as all that is it. Imagine how the losing side in a RWC final would feel having lost out because the ref decided to ignore a major rule and use his judgement instead. Suddenly 'common sense' becomes bad refereeing at best and favouritism at worst. Had Warburton not been sent off and France gone out I dare say the French would have had quite a bit to say about that decision and I don't think they'd have been praising the ref for using his common sense.

The IRB defined the rule quite clearly so from what I can see the ref. had no choice in the matter. If the rules regarding these situations are rewritten to allow more 'interpretation' by the ref. and require consultation with the other match officials before decisions are made in such cases then that might be the best, if not perfect, way to deal with this matter.

Try telling that to many British supporters of Wales yesterday and even you seem unhappy at the decision looking at your previous post of 214.

[gazzae]

Originally Posted by denphone

Try telling that to many British supporters of Wales yesterday and even you seem unhappy at the decision looking at your previous post of 214.

Ignorance of the laws does not make people correct.