Climate Change

[Mr K]

Originally Posted by OLD BOY

I don’t think people would have taken kindly to having to pay thousands of pounds for a new boiler before they needed one. I think when the electorate wakes up to what was going to happen under previous proposals, which Starmer is still committed to, they will vote for what’s best for their pockets.

---------- Post added at 20:04 ---------- Previous post was at 20:01 ----------



He’s not backtracking, just setting out an alternative way of getting there.

We are still ahead of everyone else, so what’s your point? Were you happy to be replacing your stuff earlier than you had to in order to meet these targets? If so, you must be rolling in it, and nice to see you’re all right, Jack.

What about the many working class people who can’t afford to do that?

All very well today, OB, what about tomorrow? Politicians are short termists. 27c this weekend, is that normal in October? It's coming sooner than we think, no ice left at the poles, the SE under water , economic and human carnage. The chances of doing anything about it are diminishing. Delaying because its politically convenient could be the tipping point. . How is that good for anyone's pocket?

Yes the Govt needs to help those that can't afford to change, and pressurise other countries. It's their job. The only thing they can think of is the next election.

[Sephiroth]

Originally Posted by Mr K

All very well today, OB, what about tomorrow? Politicians are short termists. 27c this weekend, is that normal in October? It's coming sooner than we think, no ice left at the poles, the SE under water , economic and human carnage. The chances of doing anything about it are diminishing. Delaying because its politically convenient could be the tipping point. . How is that good for anyone's pocket?

Yes the Govt needs to help those that can't afford to change, and pressurise other countries. It's their job. The only thing they can think of is the next election.

I remember way back when at the end of September and beginning of October, for a few days, temperatures where 79/80 F.

However, the melting ice will, apparently, affect the Jet Stream as the warm sea currents change. When/if that change takes hold, we will be colder. We can't stop that - it's part of the 140,000 year cycle.

The problem in the UK is that our contribution to the global problem is pifflingly small. The rush to net zero must not send us broke.

[Mr K]

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

I remember way back when at the end of September and beginning of October, for a few days, temperatures where 79/80 F.

However, the melting ice will, apparently, affect the Jet Stream as the warm sea currents change. When/if that change takes hold, we will be colder. We can't stop that - it's part of the 140,000 year cycle.

The problem in the UK is that our contribution to the global problem is pifflingly small. The rush to net zero must not send us broke.

The 140 000 year cycle that's now occurred within the last 60 years and is acclerating exponentially away? We are outside the broken cycle.

Rich or broke its irrelevant if the country is flooded / invaded by climate migrants. This selfish generation can't think further than its own demise.

Originally Posted by Mr K

This selfish generation can't think further than its own demise.

Why would anyone not consider their own demise ?

The UK accounts for less than 1% of global greenhouse emissions, so we should absolutely consider if its really worth all the pain and cost for something that will have very little effect overall.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by Mr K

no ice left at the poles, the SE under water , economic and human carnage.

You forgot :

a disaster of biblical proportions, Old Testament, real wrath of God type stuff. Fire and brimstone coming down from the skies! Rivers and seas boiling! Forty years of darkness! Earthquakes, volcanoes. The dead rising from the grave! Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... MASS HYSTERIA!

If your going to go, go big.

[ianch99]

Originally Posted by Pierre

You forgot :

a disaster of biblical proportions, Old Testament, real wrath of God type stuff. Fire and brimstone coming down from the skies! Rivers and seas boiling! Forty years of darkness! Earthquakes, volcanoes. The dead rising from the grave! Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... MASS HYSTERIA!

If your going to go, go big.

You are being silly

---------- Post added at 19:33 ---------- Previous post was at 19:30 ----------

Originally Posted by Paul

Why would anyone not consider their own demise ?

The UK accounts for less than 1% of global greenhouse emissions, so we should absolutely consider if its really worth all the pain and cost for something that will have very little effect overall.

This may help?

https://eciu.net/insights/2021/why-t...-is-a-big-deal

It's often claimed the UK, at 1% of global emissions, is too small to have an impact, often followed by 'what about China?'. But there's so much wrong with that calculation...

---------- Post added at 19:35 ---------- Previous post was at 19:33 ----------

There are also cumulative emissions to consider:

https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis...limate-change/

Historical responsibility for climate change is at the heart of debates over climate justice.

History matters because the cumulative amount of carbon dioxide (CO2) emitted since the start of the industrial revolution is closely tied to the 1.2C of warming that has already occurred.

[Pierre]

Originally Posted by ianch99

You are being silly

Obviously not a movie fan, I’m sure others here get the reference.

Originally Posted by ianch99

This may help?

Nope, just a lot blustering whch doesnt change the simple fact we contribute < 1%, so insignificant, no matter how they try and spin it.

[1andrew1]

If we followed the 1% is insignificant logic, we would divide bigger countries into many smaller ones so each contributed only1% to global warming which is insignificant so no action is required by anyone.

[Sephiroth]

Ian’s linked article does not destroy the UK’s 1% contribution argument for a number of reasons.

1/
The article is heavy on per capita emissions. They are irrelevant. It’s the number of tonnes of emissions that counts and nothing else. See China & India for details in a manner not expressed in the article.

2/
The article praises China on the one hand for its commitment to wind down on carbon emissions, but criticises the 1% argument for having China manufacture our stuff.

3/
The article does not address an important question for the UK: should we make our population go broke for the sake of our 1%, being forced to buy expensive heat pumps, rip out radiators for larger ones that won’t fit under the window, etc?

The scientists would be better employed calculating the temperature rise based on India’s and China’s plans for de-carbonisation and then finding solutions to the climate issues that would ensue.

And you, Ian, need to get real and stop virtue signalling.




---------- Post added at 09:44 ---------- Previous post was at 09:36 ----------

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

If we followed the 1% is insignificant logic, we would divide bigger countries into many smaller ones so each contributed only1% to global warming which is insignificant so no action is required by anyone.

How silly is that? There is no practical logic to that piece of theory.

The fact is that the matters under our control are those being addressed by the government, which is where our 1% comes into play.

Our 1% is important in the round, because it is part of a world collective effort (at least I hope the collective part really happens).

Originally Posted by Pierre

Obviously not a movie fan, I’m sure others here get the reference.

Don’t Look Up!

[Mr K]

Originally Posted by Hugh

Don’t Look Up!

They'd be better looking at the 2050 flood map which might give some pause for thought.
https://www.countryliving.com/uk/new...ng-sea-levels/

Originally Posted by Mr K

They'd be better looking at the 2050 flood map which might give some pause for thought.
https://www.countryliving.com/uk/new...ng-sea-levels/

HHGTTG SEP

Don’t forget your towel…

Originally Posted by 1andrew1

If we followed the 1% is insignificant logic, we would divide bigger countries into many smaller ones so each contributed only1% to global warming which is insignificant so no action is required by anyone.

Complete and utter nonsense, if thats your best argument, give up.

---------- Post added at 15:36 ---------- Previous post was at 15:33 ----------

Originally Posted by Mr K

They'd be better looking at the 2050 flood map which might give some pause for thought.
https://www.countryliving.com/uk/new...ng-sea-levels/

In fact, sea levels around the English coast are forecast to be around 35cm higher by 2050

All the sea defences Ive seen on the east coast are more than 35 cm high.

Still, I'm sure its not that hard to build an 18 inch wall (10cm to spare).

---------- Post added at 15:37 ---------- Previous post was at 15:36 ----------

Originally Posted by Hugh

HHGTTG SEP

Huh

https://www.bernsteincrisismanagemen...0that%20it%27s

In The Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy, author Douglas Adams famously described the “Somebody Else’s Problem” (SEP) cloaking device as the perfect way to hide even the most noticeable of items, writing, “An SEP is something we can’t see, or don’t see, or our brain doesn’t let us see, because we think that it’s somebody else’s problem. That’s what SEP means. Somebody Else’s Problem. The brain just edits it out, it’s like a blind spot.”

HHGTTG - Hitchikers Guide To The Galaxy
SEP - Somebody Else’s Problem