Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I suspect TimeLord2018 misread 'reshore' as 'offshore'.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

We haven't changed our heating since working from home so that bill has only gone up when I need a burst of heat but well insulated home should hold a lot of heat. Power for a laptop and a couple of monitors is minimal and insurance shouldn't change much. You are not conducting a business from home, you don't need to insure your companies kit and being at home more make less likely to be targeted surely?


Petrol is a big cost and why waste it spending extra couple of hours a day to drive to an office to join Webex for colleagues in other offices?


But it's nationally we need to get usage down. A problem now is that companies are opening offices but many staff are working from home. So they are using energy to heat/light space that is minimally used.


Electricity generation should have been mostly nuclear/renewable by now leaving gas (especially) for domestic use where it's harder to change. But we also have to think globally. Other nations also want fuel and energy and have growing classes also wanting "what we have".


Finally to petro companies still flame off gas because it's too difficult to deal with? Why? That should be stopped.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

It's to stop possible explosions occurring, it's called flaring.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Working from home attracts tax relief. My accountant told me that I only have to work from home for at least one day in any tax year to qualify.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

It does. You do have to submit yourself to the annual inconvenience of submitting a self-assessment tax return but it’s worth it. You can claim tax relief on a number of home office expenses (unless your employer is paying those expenses to you of course). You can also claim for wear and tear and additional insurance costs. My taxable income was reduced by just under £1,000 last year by this means.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

You can probably do that for PAYE to, I do for other things most years but haven't bothered for the last couple, saving them up!

My father in law got his electric and gas bill for the last 18 months today, £10 000 :shocked: goodness knows what it'll be in the next eighteen months and it certainly puts my up to 20 quid a month rise in to perspective :(

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

It must cost quite a lot to heat that indoor swimming pool. :confused::shocked:

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

How the heck can his bills be that high? Is he heating an open-air swimming pool? :Yikes:

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

It's £550 odd a month by my reckoning, they do use a lot of gas and electric but this is before the rises have really kicked in, father in law is quite blasé about it but I think I'm going to get his daughter on the case, it's her inheritance after all!

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Its what accountants are for. :D

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Google the headline to read the article free, or visit https://www.ft.com/content/d246f8b4-...1-7779acc5efd7

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Together Energy Retail has stopped trading, affecting 176,000 households.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-60038685

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Sorry for everyone affected, but ridiculous for a council to invest so much money in an energy supplier.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Our council invested in Icelandic banks and that didn't end well.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I think that was slightly different as they were on a panel of approved banks for councils to put their cash in. Not a 50% stake in a commercial company.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Interesting to read how much gas the UK is actually exporting!
https://twitter.com/_richardblack/st...21893277134849

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I'm on Self Assessment anyway due to my business and investment interests, my accountant sorts it all out.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

So when did the UK run out of gas?
The UK only depends on Russia for 3% of gas, Western Europe relies on 40%. They are the ones with the bigger problem.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

We haven't 'run out' of gas, but it's sold to those who will pay more than the UK to have it ;)

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Unless, of course, Europe (Norway, Netherlands, & Belgium) decides to use the 35% of our gas supply they export to us, or if the price of wholescale gas escalates even further due to sanctions on Russia...

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I don't think the Tweeter in question was quite arguing over whether we may or may not run out of gas. Rather he was interested in the argument that the present high wholesale prices don't justify further exploration or exploitation, because they would still be sold on a global market and would not be dedicated to the UK and capable of giving us much lower prices than anywhere else.

I think his argument falls down a bit because if we were able to significantly increase the commodity available in the market then the global price would come down; plus, natural resources extracted from the UK do generate income for the treasury. So it's not quite as black and white as all that.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Unfortunately, not that simple.

We exported around 1 TWh of natural gas, but imported around 478 TWh of natural gas (pages 4 and 5 of attached document).

https://assets.publishing.service.go...atural_gas.pdf

https://assets.publishing.service.go.../DUKES_4.5.xls

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

How much was the exported price?
How much was the imported price?

;)

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Come on! It's the UK - we probably sold it for half of what it cost to import... :D

(pretty sure we didn't sell it for nearly 500 times the import cost.. ;))

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Just catching up on this thread. Did you ever find out what this was?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Our forced move to Scottish Power is now complete. Based on the past 2 years' consumption, we'll be paying around £45 per year more, but the DD is staying at £92 pm due to the transferred credit of £240.

The April change of the cap will be painful though.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Got a horrible feeling the more I thought about it and did crude calculations that it's right! I will look into it for them as the partners health isn't great and she finds their lack of concern about it/ lack of will to change their ways exasperating, as do I tbf but then they're not my parents!

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

that is an insane amount of consumption though

£555 a month
£18 a day
Which equates if just electric to 90 Kwh a day consumption

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Maybe check what they’ve got in the attic. Do they spend an unusually large amount on compost bags as well?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

an 8 plant grow only costs about £250 in energy for the full grow so even if it was a farm it would struggle to cost that much unless it was maxing out the house electrics hahahaha

so I been told haha

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

:devsmoke:

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

We've just had our £140 Warm Home Discount, I make sure we apply for it before the end of September each year.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

£200 here in Scotland.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Yes that's my crude calculation to, ama zing isn't it, they do so many daft things, you wouldn't believe they were doctors not that long ago

No but there's rooms they've not been in for years that they're heating, having the window open and the heating on, having the hot water on all day and then not having a bath, so much stuff they do boggles my mind and there's so much more they do on top of that, I will check it out but I wouldn't be shocked if I come away without a discount

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I'm curious why they didnt get a bill for 18 months ? that seems a huge gap.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Maybe electric heaters as well?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I do intend to ask that question to

Definitely, one of them is all but housebound now and stays down stairs with one on all day and night, I say to her she's not getting the benefit as there is usually something in between it and her but it's like banging your head against a poorly insulated wall, I am going to have to ring on their behalf soon as although they're very blasé now, this is pre the massive price rises

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

There's a law that prevents energy companies from back-billing more than 12 months if the customer is not at fault for the billing delay. It could save you a sizeable amount of what's been requested.

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/ne...ce-from-today/

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Brilliant, thanks a lot

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Try not to make any snide comments about her or her disability- this is likely to create a barrier between you both and you won't get anywhere.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Try to mind your own business, I'm not interested in anything you have to say on this or anything else

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

This is exactly the sort of attitude that I fear you will be adopting with the lady in question. Your treatment and attitude towards those with disabilities is well documented, hopefully the fact that you will be speaking to your partners mother will encourage you to speak to her in a respectful and empathetic manner.

I wish you luck, as it does sound like a horrendous amount they are spending on energy.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Yes my treatment of people with disabilities is well documented on here, Jefferson was one of my oldest and closest friends. My treatment towards you is nothing to do with disabilities, it's just I find you deeply unpleasant, as do most users of this forum

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Nonsense. A quick look at both our previous posts shows the exact opposite of your ascertation. You were recently accused by admin of having an immature disposition, which I have now witnessed for myself
.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

What's nonsense, that Jefferson and I were friends or that most users of this forum find you unpleasant?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

For anyone who like me was transferred to British Gas when their supplier went bust or is with them through choice, I did a live chat with them last week and have switched to their HomeEnergy Secure June 2023 tariff. It's is actually a few pounds per month cheaper than the price cap and, as the name suggests, is fixed until June next year so I'm protected against the expected rises in the price cap.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I'm glad someone had the balls to speak the truth.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

The whole of your post is nonsense.

The old "It's not because you're black/gay/disabled/female etc (delete as appropriate), it's because I don't like you defense has been tried, and failed, for years, as has the "I can't be ableist because I had a disabled friend/those I know are OK" proclamations.

Anyway, rather than waste time on this, I suggest that you spend some time thinking about the tone and vocabulary that you are going to use when speaking to your mother in law.

As someone of advancing years with a disability and obviously female, she may well find your advice (however well intentioned) to be patronising and interference into her personal financial affairs.

You are going to have to be very careful how you handle this. In fact, your apparent poor social/interaction skills may only serve to make matters worse by causing family rifts. Thinking about it, it's probably a better idea for your partner to broach the subject.

---------- Post added at 09:33 ---------- Previous post was at 09:25 ----------

So you thought it would be a good idea to do some shit stirring about a sensitive subject? Really?

You have absolutely nothing to support your allegation that this is the definitive truth and are either simply trolling or, for reasons that aren't difficult to work out, are purposely trying to cause upset and unpleasantness for a severely disabled member of this forum.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

irony meter went off the scale reading that . . . .

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Anyway, back on topic....


Do you think the government is going ot step in to stop the constant price hikes?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

They could cut out vat and the green levy but i doubt they will.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Energy costs are largely influenced by global prices, though the UK's lack of gas storage has kept energy prices more volatile than some other countries. So if the UK government said no price rises to energy suppliers, they would go out of business.

Expect a new price cap on 7th February with some limited assistance to those most in need.

---------- Post added at 11:50 ---------- Previous post was at 11:48 ----------

Agreed. Also most of the so-called green levy goes to pay things like the winter fuel allowance for pensioners so if it was cut then how would these benefits be funded?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Do you have a link to that, I can't find any info on how it's funded.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

It's on the Ofcom site, the government regulator.

For a dual fuel customer, the environmental/social obligation costs comprise 15.33% of the bill. See https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publication...es-and-profits

What are the environmental/social obligations?
See https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/environment...social-schemes

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

If anyone is going to get help it will be the poorest of people, which fair enough is needed, but other people who are not swimming in money and have families to feed are also going to struggle but will get burger all becuase we earn slightly more than the capped rate for receiving benefits.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

That's actually less than what's been touted by some of the media, they were talking about it being about 25% when I heard a discussion about it.

AIUI, the Winter Fuel Allowance is paid for out of general taxation. It's the £140 for those on means tested benefits that comes out of the levy.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

FFS, Ive had enough of you constantly playing the "disabled" card.
You are banned from this topic for 7 days (of course, you wont be able to see this message, its for the benefit of others).

Ok, Back to the topic in hand please.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Gas and oil prices are not set by governments, but by bodies like OPEC and Putin's oligarchs.

Putin has a lot of Europe by the danglies over natural gas supplies.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

And the evidence..............?
Europe gas prices: How far is Russia responsible?
How is Russia responsible for any of those?:confused:
It doesn't mention a factor is that Germany scaled back nuclear and coal energy production, and tried to rely on unreliable wind power, and as a result had to rely on gas instead.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

However, wasnt it mentioned that said capacity is a lot smaller than it used to be ?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Quite correct. Centrica closed an enormous storage facility in 2017 because it needed some expensive upgrades to keep going. They asked for government assistance but were refused. We lost about 70% of our storage capacity at that point, although even before that we were storing less than is typically the case in European countries. Today we store 2% of annual demand while the average in the EU is 25%.

Some stats from a storage provider that still operates in the UK: https://www.storengy.co.uk/medias/ne...er-gas-storage

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

From 1st of April average energy bills will go up by 54%

Bills for the average customer on a default tariff will rise to £1,971 a year from £1,277
Prepayment customers will see an increase of £708 from £1,309 to £2,017

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-60236456

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Did they announce a unit rate for this as I find these total rates uses less when it comes to working out for the individual

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Rishi rides to the rescue …

£150 council tax rebate for bands A-D (boo, I’m in band E)
£200 energy bill discount for every household this October, followed by a £40 annual surcharge once a year for the next 5 years, to smooth out the shock.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

So we get £200 to cover the price rise we are going to see in October anyway and have to pay it back? does nothing for the shock of this price rise

The CT rebate I will not see as I get most of it paid anyway unless that comes off the bit I do have to pay

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I wish that our new boiler replaced a really old cruddy one but the old one was pretty efficient just getting to that age where spares where getting hard/impossible to find.


Trying to get to BG to cancel our service cover as new boiler doesn't really need it. Odd pricing - cover boiler, heating, plumbing, electrics, drains is around £36/month. Remove the boiler (and heating) and it's £85. Tried to cancel on-line but need to phone them, phone them - we are only dealing with emergencies use on-line.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

You will see your overall council tax bill reduce by £150, so if you’re paying anything towards it at all you will see that amount reduce. Precisely how much will depend on whether the council tax benefit %age is calculated on the amount initially demanded by the council or the amount actually owing after the discount.

The £200 reduction in October is a response to the present cap increase. Having taken these measures today, I think Sunak has made it politically impossible for him not to act again in the event of a further crippling rise in the cap in October. But we will have to wait and see.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

So it looks like this will be happening:

1. The vast majority of households will be given £350 - just over half the amount energy bills are expected to increase annually.

All households? Everyone?

1. All electricity customers will receive a £200 discount from October on bills. The government will meet the cost in full. This will have to be repaid by customers in equal £40 instalments over the next five years
   
   What about if I have dual fuel? Everyone?

1. A £150 council tax rebate to help with the cost of energy in April - This won’t need to be repaid.

No doubt that will only be for those on low incomes.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

The £150 will not be done on income it will be given to those in council tax bands A-D.

However, there will also be a new discretionary fund of £150m for councils to help low-income people who live in larger homes.

The Warm Homes Discount will expand from 2m to 3m people.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Been in meetings most of the morning so have missed all but the headlines. Who's funding the £150? I know ultimately 'we the people' will pay one way or another but is central government going to refund local councils, or are local councils going to be expected to make even more cuts to wholly or partly cover the reduced income?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

If all this does end up being the case this rise I can cover comfortably enough will have to see what happens with the next one. If the CT comes off the initial figure I will not see much of it but if it comes off the final figure I will have to pay next to nothing

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I wonder how the rebate will work for households that are exempt from paying council tax?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Copied from Ofgem site so gas users hit with a higher increase than electric

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

At the moment, after being moved from Orbit to Scottish Power, the prices are Electricity 21.180p per kWh, Gas 4.174p per kWh.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

no they are the final figures. Not sure if Vat is added or not though

Dunno why you are paying that much though as they are over the old price cap figures I posted earlier in this thread


These are the October Price Cap Figures so for some reason you are paying more than them. Your Gas figure has to be wrong

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Going to be a bit of a wait for the discount.
Link

People will be receiving higher quarterly bills before then, as well as those on PAYG meters costing more.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Probably timed so the govt doesn't have to do more come the October prise cap change. I'm annoyed at politicians and the media describing it as a discount, when the money has to be paid back. Imagine the uproar if a dealership referred to a car loan as a 'discount'.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Lets be honest about this though, they are not obliged to do anything. These price rises are not this Governments fault. Increased demand has led to increased wholesale prices. If you want to blame a government you will need to go back 30 plus years and blame those who decided not to increase gas storage and not invest in more nuclear power stations

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

The reduction in gas storage occurred recently - in 2017.
https://www.theguardian.com/business...h-gas-centrica

I think some responsibility must be attributed to Ofgem as well as the government and market forces.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I said nothing about reducing storage

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Then how come EU countries are also badly affected?:rolleyes:

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Because demand has gone up worldwide?

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

From Spring 2021 I was paying Orbit Electricity 11.399 per kWh, Gas 2.431 per kWh


Then in October 2021 there was a big jump Electricity 24.761 per kwh, Gas 6.018 per kwh.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

you typoed your gas and put 26p. I was paying similar with Avro

The electric is higher than the cap though

---------- Post added at 17:33 ---------- Previous post was at 17:30 ----------

this is why the prices are high. High demand. India and Germany are among the countries that have switched to gas and I believe China has to meaning supplies have dwindled.

Of course those farming the gas (I dunno what you would call a group of wells or fraking set ups) do not have to increase the prices they just are because of supply and demand meaning the rest of us have to pay the extra while the oligarchs are laughing all the way to the bank

Just for one minute think what will happen Russia does invade the Ukraine and the UK and EU start sanctioning them and they decide to either cut off the gas line or increase the price even more. Shell won't mind but the rest of us will

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Let's be really honest they wouldn't do anything if they didn't think votes would be lost if they did nothing and it's clearly not their fault, 12 years in power isn't enough time to sort anything out

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Gas price has nohing to do with "oligarchs" Russia at present is delivering the gas that was ordered.So there's no blame there.

That said demand has risen because wind power dropped off due to lack of wind.who'd of thought?

So, any coumtry relying on renewable power now had to purchace more gas to keep the lights on.

When you have to purchse more gas you have to do it on the international market. Supply and demand, Asia is driving the price up, not Russia.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Those who farm and sell the gas choose the price. Asia using more gas does not increase the price greed does

---------- Post added at 19:57 ---------- Previous post was at 19:57 ----------

I said governments 30 years ago

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I know what you said and disagree with you, 12 years they've had to see the problems previous regime's have left and correct them or at least put plans in place , the fact they haven't is down to them, no one else

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

The prices are not being set by the sellers, they are being set by the buyers.:rolleyes: That is how auctions work.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

we both have our points and they are both equally correct. No government in my lifetime have ever planned for the future as far as I can see

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Large-scale infrastructure projects are long-term and exceed the term of the government so are planning for the future. Look at Crossrail and HS2, for example.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Yeah and that is why I originally said that things should have been done 30 years ago

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

I'd rather see more nuclear power plants.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Rolls-Royce’s new Small Modular Reactor should help here, but despite being designed to be far less complicated to build and operate, we’re not going to see one on the grid for a while yet as nobody’s actually signed up for one … AFAIK they’re still about 3 years off specifying exactly what they will build and where.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

And how exactly would gas storage solve anything?

Germany only has capacity for a quarter of their annual consumption, and it has to be filled up at the new higher costs. A quarter of Germany's gas storage is owned by GazProm.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

https://www.rpsgroup.com/insights/en...ansition-mix/# https://www.eua.org.uk/uploads/57285500B54F4.pdf

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Gas storage facilities are privately owned. The gas in them has to be paid for in advance, as well as the cost of eventual higher cost of refilling the storage.

The fact that gas prices in Germany are also shooting up, demonstrates that having gas storage achieves little on that issue. Germany used its stored gas to cope with increased demand and lower Wind power output, NOT increased prices.

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

Globally, this net zero thing has had an impact after all, but probably not the impact everyone was talking about ;)

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

The UK used to drill its own Gas Wells if it invested in storage and did not sell it all off we would not have to buy any from anyone else. This is why I have banged my head against a brick wall with the 30+ years ago when it all got screwed up

British Gas was privatised in 1986 by that wonderful prime minister Thatcher we are in this mess imo directly due to this event in history

Re: Energy companies collapse
 

It could be a government-owned British Gas would have sold the storage off as well, we just don't know.

To me, it's a failure of regulation. The regulator should have ensured a strategic gas storage facility remained and there was a funding mechanism in place to ensure this.